- Participants:
- Russell Goodwin, Director of Marketing & Events
- Claudia Castaneda, Director of Regional Operations
- Lela Butler, Director of Coding & Compliance
- Tarun Sharma, Vice President of Product & Automation
- Facilitator: Trish Thomas, Marketing & Communications Lead at Advantum
Roundtable Description: Diversity and inclusion initiatives are top-of-mind at US companies large and small. But what does diversity really mean? What does it accomplish in the lives of employees? And how do we measure the real impact on innovation, customer satisfaction, performance and overall corporate success? Browse highlights from our recent lively discussion with 5 diverse members of Advantum’s staff. More than a how-to session or culture brainstorm, this was a real-world conversation about diversity ideals, the people they touch, and the outcomes they deliver.
Q1: Define what the word “diversity” means to you?
Russell:
Diversity has several layers for me. Initially, I think of the seven protected classes, but it goes a little bit beyond that because people of the same race or sexuality or even nationality may have different cultural backgrounds and upbringings. So diversity to me is also diversity of perception, mindset and cultural beliefs as well. You know, a box of Crayola crayons. From a political standpoint, religious standpoint, even culturally. It’s a very beautiful thing to me.
Lela:
When I think of diversity, I think of a big old variety pack where you have all these different types of donuts to pick and choose from. I also think it’s a beautiful thing. Also, I’ve done a little research and ethnically diverse companies outperform others by 33%. So to have diversity in your organization is a win all the way around.
Tarun:
When I was growing up, diversity for me was a different race, different culture, different community, different religions. But I agree with the others, that diversity is about the different perspectives, personal characteristics, and attributes. When teams come together with different mindsets, the best ideas come out.
Claudia:
Wow, I think the team has hit the nail right on the head. To me, when you say diversity, the first word that comes to my mind would be color – and not skin color. It is more of an umbrella, and under that umbrella there are so many facets. It’s different people with different experiences through all facets of life. Gender, religion, culture, language…all of those represent diversity for me, and it is a very beautiful thing, and it should be embraced. I like our Krispy Kreme doughnuts metaphor, but I will use a rainbow!
Trish:
I couldn’t agree with all of you more. Having a long background in strategy and innovation, it really is the companies that welcome ideas from all corners of the company, all different backgrounds, all different types of individuals, that truly tend to excel and thrive over time.
Q2: When we think about taking that concept of diversity and applying it to the workplace, what factors represent a diverse and inclusive workplace to each of you?
Tarun:
Being with this company for so long, I have seen changes in the leadership, the way we used to work, and the way we are working right now. Equal opportunities mean you listen to whoever comes up with a good idea. It’s just not restricted to who is sitting across from you, but really who is bringing valuable input. I think our company is definitely doing very well in fostering diversity. And when it comes to culture we celebrate it all. In India, we celebrate Diwali, which is the biggest festival of the country – similar to Christmas in the US – and it is celebrated equally. I had been with different companies before where it was pretty much the male dominant situation you talked about, Trish. That does not exist in our organization.
Claudia:
I would agree. I think Advantum has a lot of diversity. For any organization to be truly diverse is making sure that we have representation from all different backgrounds at the table, and being able to share our experiences and our thoughts without being judged. And having our offshore team in India and being able to interact with them on a daily basis. I’ve not worked for an organization until Advantum that had that ability to do that.
Lela:
So for me, I think given the fact that we spend at least 1/3 of our lives at work, the ability to recognize and respect others allows us to transition that outside of the workplace to make a better overall world for everyone. I’ve worked with diverse companies before, but not in terms of a whole other country, as with India. So I was very excited when I found that here.
Trish:
And now we’re adding the new call center team in Mexico, so pulling in yet another country.
All:
Very, very excited. Really exciting news!
Russell:
I want to talk about some things that I look for personally within organizations. I come from state government – which is a massively diverse organization of over 30,000 employees across the state. So one of the things that I look for in an employer – and this is even an interview question – involves equity. We hear a lot about inclusion, but should also consider equity. What opportunities are there for folks that may want to seek advancement? I think Advantum does a good job of that in terms of our leadership.Having a diverse leadership team was a big part of why I decided to work at this organization. Inclusion is making sure that people are invited to the party. And I like to say that equity is making sure that everybody’s on the dance floor with the opportunity to groove to the same beat. A sense of belonging within any organization is very critical, because as someone stated before, we spend a lot of our time at work and you want to feel welcome. You want to feel as if there are other folks that understand and listen to you. You want a safe space where anyone feels capable of speaking up without any retaliation.
Q3: Do any of you have an example of diversity making a tangible positive impact on a specific situation or outcome?
Lela:
Yes, so my story is from working for a company with a male CEO on our side, and a company that we were working with had a female CEO. They did not get along. They could not stand each other. On the calls you would just want to disappear! She felt that he was just too aggressive and overbearing. So they called me in, and I was able to be the middleman and make that relationship better. We wound up having a very good working relationship.
Trish:
That’s fantastic. For you to have a proactive role and mend the fences, so to speak. Does anybody else have a positive diversity example?
Tarun:
I’ll go next. In 2010 I switched my job – and the city as well. In India, it’s North and South, right? Different cultures. You are not welcome on day one. So I joined one company towards the South of India and it was a little difficult for me to make a stand. However, when I brought up ideas I saw how things can be transformed and changed. The US team and my supervisor, who was local, listened to me. He gave me a free hand to pick my own team. When I joined, we were at about $18 million per month. The expectation was about $30 million per month. So in three months I put together a team on the basis of their performance and their skill set. And in just three to four months we started achieving $32 million per month. I was even promoted as director within six months. If my supervisor had not been open enough to listen to me, we would probably not have been able to achieve what we achieved.
Russell:
I don’t have one personally, but working in marketing I often see different advertising campaigns that offend specific groups, and I’ve taken a step back and said, “why did that happen?” If we peel those layers back, we’ll find out that the people that need to be at the table aren’t at the table. I think Dove got in trouble a couple of years ago, along with a few other organizations. If you don’t have the right people at the table to speak up, it can be detrimental to an organization. Having a diverse group is very beneficial not only internally, but also in how you’re perceived within a community – making sure all voices are heard and to not offend anyone. It’s the smart thing to do.
Claudia:
I would piggyback on what Russell said. And also on what Lela said. There are so many case studies that show that when we have diverse leadership, performance metrics and outcomes are so much better. Having a safe environment to speak up is also important, because when we feel that we are not safe, we are not going to say anything that goes against the norm. Using your marketing example, why would anybody say, “oh, that’s not gonna fly,” or “that’s gonna be offensive” if the group is going to turn around and say “we’re going with it.”
Trish:
That’s a really great segue into our next discussion topic. I want to talk about the pitfalls of the corporate diversity and inclusion initiatives that are underway in a lot of companies right now. Claudia, you just mentioned one, which is inviting people to have a voice and a seat at the table, but then not listening to them when they speak up.
Q4: What are some of the other potential pitfalls of really pushing in this diversity and inclusion direction?
Claudia:
I think that when people hear “diversity and inclusion,” it’s a lot about policy and the training behind it, but they forget it’s really about behaviors. They forget that it’s about business processes, how we do things internally, and that there is unconscious bias associated. What really matters are our behaviors towards each other! The pitfalls are that if we just focus on policy and training and we forget about the people and behaviors and everything else that happens, that is detrimental. You’re not following what you’re saying. You’re not living it.
Lela:
Yes, I was gonna say something similar. You have to determine the reason that you’re bringing diversity and inclusion into the workplace. Is it just because it’s mandated? Or are you really wanting to incorporate those different genders and racial and socioeconomic differences into the organization? For me that would be one of the pitfalls. Why are you doing this?
Trish:
Not just giving lip service to it, but really walking the walk.
Tarun:
I think resistance to change can also be one of the pitfalls. If there is no mutual respect, we ignore what the other person is talking about or just don’t care. If I don’t want to change, and I don’t want to accept, I would not be able to contribute to diversity in that particular environment. I think we should build some kind of training or sessions to bring everyone together to be in sync and work collaboratively.
Claudia:
We have to want to learn about each other, right? I genuinely want to learn about your holidays, Tarun, and that’s really when you see diversity at its best. The minute we stop learning it goes out the window.
Trish:
Curiosity, the ability to listen, authentic interest in other people, is all critical. We’ve been seeing this push to advance workplace diversity and inclusion for a number of years now, particularly in the US.
Q5: From what all of you have seen, how much progress have companies really made?
Lela:
When we look at the US overall, we’ve had a past minority President, current minority Vice President. So that makes you kind of hopeful for the future.
Claudia:
I think we’ve seen positive pockets of improvement depending on where you are in the United States. Being born and raised in New Jersey, to me, diversity was never a question. Because that’s all I know, right? So when you go to other places and you don’t see the color of the rainbow, that’s when you miss it. I would say we’ve made improvement, but there is still so much room to go. With women in leadership alone, there’s this stigma of sometimes women being perceived as aggressive and emotional. But if you turn it around to a man, they’re just conducting business as usual. Tammy, our CEO, is a great representative for Advantum. There’s a lot of women in leadership in Advantum and that is awesome. There are not many companies like that.
Trish:
I remember reading a statistic a number of years ago that there were more male CEOs named John in the Fortune 500 then there were women CEOs. And I thought, wow, that really just sums it all up.
Tarun:
If you look at other companies, you have different CEOs. Not just the background they are coming from, but because of the knowledge that they’re bringing in, and that’s how the company prospers. So yeah, I think it’s working. But nothing is perfect. It’s a constant effort that we all have to make. It’s a collective effort that is needed to make things better. You cannot say “oh, we achieved it.”
Trish:
There’s no endpoint, so true, so true.
Russell:
I would say we definitely have progressed. I think organizations that are much more intentional about diversity and inclusion have progressed significantly more than others. There are organizations that are being forced to be much more aware of the changes in our world – and be much more equitable. We’ve come a long way. I’m seeing a lot more women in leadership, more races and different makeups in leadership roles. I think as a society we’re much more open to it. But diversity always comes with a fight before there’s any formal progression. Change is hard for people. There will be pushback, but I think we’ve reached a place in society where we’re much more open and understanding. If we continue being intentional and socially conscious of the world around us, that makes a difference.
Another thing that stays top of mind for me is disability awareness. When I go to different buildings and restaurants, I’m not wheelchair bound, but I ask myself, “is this organization providing access to people who are wheelchair bound?” Even mental health matters. You’re hearing a lot about mental health days and things of that nature. We’ve come a long way and we’ve got a long way to go.
Trish:
In closing, I’d love to hear from each of you one idea or one piece of advice grounded in your own personal experiences to help improve workplace diversity and inclusion.
Q6: What is your one closing message?
Tarun:
I’ll take it. If we don’t commit to it – we won’t be able to achieve true diversity and inclusion. I’m not referring to commitment from the boss, from the CEO. I’m talking about all of us. If we commit, we can definitely create a workforce culture that is better. For me it’s a commitment and conscious effort.
Lela:
For me, I would say it would be racial diversity. Just because I am an African-American female and I often feel underrepresented, especially in more senior level positions. You kind of look around and feel like you’re the only person you know in this field who is from your specific racial background. So I would like to see more racial diversity in that regard.
Claudia:
I think the one piece of advice that I would give is get to know the person. Forget about the type of clothes they have on, forget about the shoes that they wear, or the purse, or the car they drive, or the house they live in. Truly just get to know that person. Because in getting to know the person, then everything else just falls in place. You’re gonna go above and beyond to help a co-worker because you truly like them, and that really is what it’s about. It’s about people. Treating everybody like a human being. And Russell, I really like the fact that you brought up mobility diversity. There’s generational diversity. There’s so many things to think about. But if we forget about all that and just genuinely be kind to one another it should fall in place.
I was born and raised on the East Coast in New Jersey, and I’ve been blessed to travel overseas to South America, Central America. I know a ton of people- and they’re people! Regardless of how they live. You just have to be open and non-judgmental.
Trish:
Kindness is key. Russell, I’ll let you close us out.
Russell:
Everybody has some great points. I’m hearing keywords that keep coming up, and I think if these keywords were around the wall at organizations they would stay top of mind. Understanding, which I think is huge. Making sure that we’re not bringing our biases to the table. Empowering employees. If it comes from the top down when we’re talking about diversity and inclusion it feels like it’s being forced.
Another one of those keywords is being authentic. If an organization says “today we’re gonna celebrate Africa Day with everybody wearing Kente cloth.” That’s not authentic. So I think having an understanding of cultures and empowering staff to start groups of other like minded individuals within the organization is key to starting grassroots movement from inside so that efforts are not perceived as being inauthentic. That is huge. I think Advantum does a good job of that. We host open book sessions and warrior leagues where people are giving their backgrounds and learning more about, like Claudia said, the individual and who they are as a person.
Trish:
Great, great conversation. I know that we could probably riff on this topic for quite a while longer, but I’m gonna close us out. Thanks to all four of you for joining the conversation and thanks to all of you who are listening out there.
I hope you’ve taken away some really good advice, some personal stories, some food for thought, and potentially walk away with a little bit better understanding of how to build a diverse and inclusive workplace like we are welcomed into here at Advantum Health.